About that Beauty and the Geek phone number challenge… February 4, 2007
Posted by Niels in : Beauty and the Geek , trackback
I got an email yesterday that meant a lot to me.
I just wanted to say how great it was to see you talk about how disgusting the phone number challenge was this week. You didn’t go into the details of why it upset you (or they didn’t show it, anyway), but I’m assuming it’s because you realize that using random girls to win a challenge is sleazy and that asking girls for their phone number when you have no intention of calling them is incredibly mean. (I realize that it’s possible one or more of the others on the show felt it was wrong as well and it just wasn’t shown.)
-T
Thanks, T. You get it.
Comments»
I had thought about that too for a minute then I thought that maybe those people were told what was really going on after it was over, and I assumed that you, as well as the other guys, would call a woman if she had seemed genuinely interested in you. I know I would feel like crap if a guy asked for my phone number and had no intention of calling me. I actually had something similar happen to me. I had been talking to this guy online for a year and a half(I have met him)and all of a sudden he started flirting with me big time and this went on for three days straight. I thought this guy was going to ask me out, but he never did. It turns out he wasn’r even interested in me and he has a girlfriend, then I find out he was telling lies about me to a mutual friend of ours, so now neither of them are talking to me and I didn’t even do anything wrong. I don’t know what this guy’s deal is and I thought my friend knew better than to believe a bunch of stuff that’s obviously crap. What’s worse is these men are in their late 30’s, early 40’s, you would think they would know better than to act like that at their age.
I totally agree. I mean, being asked for my phone number from a decent guy who didn’t seem like a psycho would be a boost in my self esteem, until you find out you would never be called.
Aww Niels, that’s so sweet of you!
Hey Neils this is totally off sub. but I wanted to say thanx for giving me the website for the shirt dad bought it for me.:)
Props for maintaining an ounce of integrity! Also, just wanted to say that your “bai ren kan bu dong” t-shirt on last week’s episode made my day (I couldn’t believe you were Chinese!). Asian persuasion forever.
hahaha I’m watching the marathon on the CW right now and I googled you and found this page! I think you are so adorable. You seem like such a sweet and genuine person. I was really touched when you cried when nominating Nate for elimination. I hope everything is going well for you! Have a good one.
And yet your A.O.A. thing brags about how many girls’ phone numbers you have. One minute you think it’s sleazy and the next you use it to validate yourself. I’m confused.
To the person who posted above me, there is nothing wrong with Niels bragging about being able to get so many phone numbers, he has a right to be proud of that. He never said he had a problem with having to get girls’ phone numbers, he just didn’t like that he had to get phone numbers from people he may have had no intention of ever calling and the fact that these people were unknowingly being used in the challenge. I don’t think it’s that you’re confused, I think it’s that you’re jealous. Niels, I am also watching the marathon and I cried along with you the first time I saw that episode and I did it again tonight; Cecille was stupid for making fun of you, she has no clue what a real man is.
I just watched the episode, and I was very sympathetic and very pleased with your reaction.
I would also like to say:
I think your teamwork with Jennylee is a little lacking and you should listen to her more often. Especially with the Starbucks thing… Did it really work?
But, great job in the elimination round. Keep it up and good luck!
Been readin the blog off and on since I caught a few episodes of the new season. While I want to applaud the balls it must have taken to completely shift your life direction towards something you are sincere in pursuing, there isn’t any shame in admitting some incompetency in your new calling along the way. I obviously can’t say for sure - only you yourself know - but I feel like the email from T is a bit of a cop out; you yourself admitted on the show that it was a fear of rejection, and that getting women’s phone numbers was “just a bad idea” (i.e., citing that tribe example). It was a challenge; if you felt that badly about hurting girls’ feelings w/no callback, why not come up with another motivation for getting a number, like “I need to collect phone numbers as a sign of support to save this dog from getting put to sleep at the pound” or something. Anyway, I did feel the need to voice some support for Melville’s point since all you girls are getting so defensive about things.
You know, some of his message could’ve been cut out?
Jealous of…? I’m a girl, I don’t want lots of phone numbers from girls.
And as for this: “He never said he had a problem with having to get girls’ phone numbers, he just didn’t like that he had to get phone numbers from people he may have had no intention of ever calling and the fact that these people were unknowingly being used in the challenge.”
He never said that. The person who wrote this email said that. All he said on the show is that he doesn’t like asking for girls’ numbers. And now he has people pay him to teach him to do that. It was just another cop out for doing a bad job on the show. Just like how all his answers to people’s comments are defensive cop-outs and don’t actually answer the questions.
*teach them
-not him
I meant getting phone numbers in general and the fact that he’s so well liked by people, duh. I know the person who wrote the email said that, but Niels agreed with the person(he also said it made him feel dirty), so in a way he said it, just not directly. He doesn’t just teach men how to get girls’ phone numbers, he teaches them how to act decent around them and how to treat them. It sounds like you don’t like Niels, so why are you on here? He’s doing very well on the show, if he wouldn’t be in one of the top 3 teams. There has been some miscommunication between him and Jennylee, but that’s to be expected when two people who are complete opposites are thrown together for a couple weeks; it takes months, sometimes years, for two people to understand each other. He’s made some mistakes on the show, but so has everyone else, they’re only human and nobody is perfect.
i think ur really cute
Just curious, Denise - how old are you?
Nadia, I’d forgotten that he said on the show that it was fear of rejection. If he did, you make a good point about the email being a cop out. Then again, it’s possible that he did mention ethics and honesty more in the show and it was edited out. At this point, I’m not sure how much of the blog and/or the show was an act.
At this point, I’m leaning toward it being more about fear than ethics for Niels. Keep in mind that this is from a guy who’s constantly blogging about flirting with beautiful women.
Does Niels get the permission of the women he flirts with to publish their encounters on his blog? Don’t forget that he gets income from coaching other men on how to flirt with women, so there’s definitely a financial interest. Does Niels tell the women he meets that their encounter will be publicized and used to further his career? If it’s morally questionable to use a girl and get her phone number to win a challenge unknown to her, surely it’s questionable to flirt with girls and publish personal conversations to gain infamy.
Mario on the show seemed to have a good ethical solution to the Phone Number Challenge. He ran around telling people something that was basically true, that he was asking for phone numbers to improve his self-esteem and social skills. He didn’t seem to represent to anyone that the request was anything other than an exercise, or that he intended to call them.
I think Melville’s criticisms are valid. From what Niels has revealed on the show and this blog, there has been some inconsistency that I hope he will address. Of course, if this whole thing is just meant to drum up business for his coaching work, we’ll be less likely to see that kind of integrity here and Melville’s assessment might be right on the money. So to speak.
Denise, I don’t know how anyone else feels, but I may not agree with everything I read though I may still find it interesting. Beyond that, I’m cheering for Niels to find greater virtue in himself in a modern world, and maybe answering some hard questions and reexamining his actions will help with that.
By the way, thanks to everyone here, I’ve been inspired by these questions and have been writing about it on my own page.
I’m 35, but I don’t understand why you’re asking. I think it’s ethical to post encounters and conversations without consent as long as you don’t post names.
It would all be fine if Niels was just on here talking about his life with no possibility of financial gain. However, as S. pointed out so eloquently, Niels is charging people to learn his flirting skills. Many people on this blog seem to be trying to figure out if these skills work for him, and all he does is evade the questions.
When advertising his product, he says he has so many numbers that he has to organize them by area code. But here, he is telling us that asking for girls’ numbers is wrong. And one minute, it’s wrong, and the next it’s just his fear of rejection that prevents him from getting them. Then the next minute he’s telling others how to go do this thing that he can’t/won’t do, and taking their money in exchange for the information.
Well put, S.
I’ve never seen him evade questions. He never said asking for a girl’s phone number was wrong, just asking for a phone number when you have no intention of calling the person and using them in a challenge is wrong. What’s wrong with charging people for what he does, it’s his job, he has to make a living somehow, so why not something he’s good at and loves, and at least he’s helping people. It doesn’t matter how many phone numbers a person has gotten in the past, there is always a fear of rejection.
This is all B.S.
Like it matters if he calls them or not. Like those girls in the park were going to sit up all night waiting for him to call. They would probably forget it– not to mention, in order to be on TV they had to sign a waiver, so they found out about the fact that it was a challenge soon after anyway!
People ask for other people’s numbers all the time and never call them and nobody cares. That’s an every day part of life for any social woman. His excuse is weak.
He has so many numbers he has to organize them with a filing system- does he call every one of those girls back? And according to this blog, he flirts with girls in different states and countries - girls he couldn’t possibly see again- when they give him their numbers, does he always call? I highly doubt it. It’s all just a bunch of excuses and nothing is more pathetic than someone who brags about being a stud and then can’t back it up.
In addition, he just posted something about secretly taping people on a hidden camera for his seminars. That’s far less ethical than asking someone for a number and never calling them.
no offence, but how can you possibly be a seduction TEACHER? you’ve done horribly the two challenges where you were supposed to get phone numbers. you would expect a lot more from a “guru”.
Hey! That’s a really good friend of mine! She told me she’d sent you that e-mail. I’m glad you appreciated it.
Did anybody ever stop to think that some of the things he says is sarcasm, exaggerating, and joking, the man does have a sense of humor. Just because a person lives in another state doesn’t mean he never sees them, maybe he likes to travel. I never heard him say he was a seduction teacher or a stud, I never even thought of him as any of those things, he just seems very social.
Sunil gave me the heads-up that my email was posted. He did not, however, tell me about the ensuing debate.
In response to “You know, some of his message could’ve been cut out?”: No, Niels posted my email in its entirety (except for the “I feel dorky emailing you, but…” part).
In response to those who say that on the show he cited “fear of rejection” as his problem with the challenge rather than an ethical objection: If he cited fear of rejection, I missed that part. The part I remember hearing and making note of is the one where he said he disliked what he had to do and that it made him feel dirty. I said straight out in the email that my interpretation of what he meant was just that: an interpretation based on what he said on the show.
Finally, to clarify, neither he nor I has said that getting girls’ phone numbers is wrong. As a woman, I’m flattered when a guy flirts with me or asks for my number. However, when a guy flirts or asks for a number just to prove to himself or his friends that he has the power to do it, it’s dirty and mean.
That’s exactly what I thought you said. Some people on here just don’t get it.
Maybe he didn’t want to do the challenge because he felt like it was misleading AND there was also a chance of rejection. It could be both and I don’t see a contradiction there. Also, knowing Niels personally, Niels is not into AoA to make a lot of money. Niels has always been about helping people and improving society. Why else would he go to grad school, instead of making a lot of money with a normal engineering job?
You’re a great guy Niels, don’t let these people tell you otherwise. They don’t know you.
Um… when I said “You know, some of his message could’ve been cut out,”
I meant the TV show. Not the message from T. I was talking about Neils’s feelings about it in the show. Sorry for the misunderstanding
My darling Niels! (LOL or not… don’t worry I’m not a psycho stalker) You didn’t let me down. If only everyone had Nate’s patience & kind heart, and your insight and integrity, the world would truly be a better place. That was extremely kind and considerate of you to consider the girls’ feelings above how well your team did. You are truly a man of morals! A true class act, and please never change that.